Luo Yonghao revealed that the hammer was financed by one billion yuan and was on the verge of bankruptcy.

[Netease smart news August 7 news] Yesterday afternoon, hammer technology founder and CEO Luo Yonghao disclosed at the geek park Rebuild 2017 conference, Hammer Technology has received a new round of financing of one billion yuan.

“To say that there is no moisture figure, because Nut Pro is going very well, our round of financing is probably about 1 billion in size. Not surprisingly, from the beginning of autumn, we will have about 190 million operating cash in hand. This means that we will start next year, like a regular mobile phone manufacturer, with high, medium, and low segments, and launch 5-6 products each year," said Luo Yonghao.

In addition, Luo Yonghao also disclosed the next phase of the R&D plan. He said that in the coming period, he will lead a team of 120 people to create a "revolutionary new system." This system will integrate artificial intelligence technology to overturn the current situation. Some "keyboard + mouse" interaction mode will increase the daily office efficiency by 200%.

Luo Yonghao also said that Hammer Technology had a difficult period in 2016, faced with huge losses, breakage of capital chain, repeated departures of core employees, two cases of unpaid wages, and news of the acquisition. Once on the verge of bankruptcy. Luo Yonghao said, “The 2016 is the most dangerous for the hammer.” (Yi Zhi)

The following content is reproduced in the Geek Park, collated from the geek park founders Zhang Peng and Luo Yonghao's conversation on Rebuild 2017:

Zhang Peng: Teacher Luo has a special connection with Geek Park, and is also particularly related to our “Peng You Shuo”. He should be an entrepreneur in the Eastern Hemisphere participating in Peng You’s most talks.

When he first participated in the Geek Park activities, he had just entered the tech circle. At that time, his feeling was called "The First Test." At that time, he got our "Best User Experience Award," and was very excited to swing on the stage. Hands, "I'm a user experience award!" I thought I was immature!

After a year, it changed. When we talked in Shanghai last year, Teacher Luo said particularly steadily. I am already a martial arts talent. I am not angry at all. I am always challenged and I will make him pay attention not to hurt you. Yourself. I feel more and more mature.

Then this year, we all know that the Nut Pro is very effective, so the teacher's environment has changed again. If you give him a definition this year, I think it is "King of the Hill" if you don't know "King of the Hill". What is the stalk, rush to search, in short, is a very strong soldier.

Therefore, Mr. Luo is constantly changing. We are very much looking forward to it. We do not know what kind of state of mind he is in today's situation and what kind of hammer we are all concerned about. What will happen next? Of course, there is a crucial point. How will he use the opportunities brought by this wave of smart new changes? Next we have the teacher Luo Yonghao, the founder of Hammer Technology!

(viewers): Lao Luo, I love you!

Zhang Peng: Every time there is such annoyance, grab my play!

How many units did Nut Pro sell?

Zhang Peng: The first topic that everyone cares about is Nut Pro. How many units are sold?

Luo Yonghao: The mobile phone manufacturers announced this stage for a reason. When you see Nut Pro just released, what you said online sold 500,000, 1 million, and 2 million on the same day. There are all kinds of arguments. Although we only say that 400,000 is not limited to goods, others still say that they sold 100 on the same day. Million, 2 million.

From the perspective of the manufacturer, because we do not report on the amount of brush or water, we hope to sum up this amount in a phased manner. However, because some media said that we sold hundreds of thousands on the same day, and another week sold 2 million, we have actually brought some benefits. Some of these reporters who had been willing to wait and see with us were very excited. They took the initiative to find us and showed us a lot of new technologies. This is a great advantage for us to do the next step.

So, he came to tell us, and I heard that you sold 2 million a week, etc. When we had such opening remarks, we were always undecided, and we used a thick nasal voice to say “What are you doing?”, the next conversation It's very smooth.

Therefore, we have never clarified that it is not so much. But later, because some knowledgeable scientists broke out and said that we only sold 200,000, that made us very embarrassed, because if you want to be exposed to real numbers, you can honestly say more than they say. This number is much larger, but there is no more than that. So, if you haven't clarified the result before, when you clarify it later, there is a problem with how you say this number, but you can't say false numbers. The actual situation is much more complicated.

So I hope everyone can understand that we cannot report false figures and we cannot report true figures. Only when we reach a staged summary, we will report a real number.

Zhang Peng: I think Luo skill is here. It was he who did not say anything but said 5 minutes.

Luo Yonghao: This is actually a required course for entrepreneurs.

Zhang Peng: It is not easy to be an entrepreneur, but certainly it still has to face some comments from everyone in this product. In fact, we have collected a lot of online praise and bad reviews for this product, all of which have you wondering which one to look at first?

Luo Yonghao: Let's listen first.

Zhang Peng: Optimism. Do you take a look and comment? Pick the three most correct.

Luo Yonghao: "Compared to the Flash Capsule, most of the XX assistants in the market are just silly."

"Fingerprint Unlocking", which is not our ability, is our supplier's ability because our suppliers are better at fingerprinting than Apple's suppliers. This is not our credit.

"Designers must be perfectionists." This is a certainty.

"High face value", how do we say that we know it?

"Lifetime God Machine" is like this.

Zhang Peng: "When you get your hands, it's like the girl who has been chasing for years has finally promised herself the same."

Luo Yonghao: This is a bit hypocritical, right? We are so cheap machines, you're finished. In particular, there is no shortage of cash this year. I think that some girls who may have been chasing for years have asked you not to promise, or else they will not.

Zhang Peng: Let's make a bad review. You can comment on each item.

Luo Yonghao: "The chin is big." In fact, it is not the case that the chin is bigger, but the head is smaller. Therefore, it looks like the chin is larger. This is normal.

Then, "black side touching", this is a misunderstanding, right? We say that the black border refers to the kind of pretend to have no edges. There are several kinds of colors. The black color is black. You say that the black border is logically problematic. In white, many of them see white without white, because white does not pretend that it is borderless. So, I think that the black side is mainly the version of the wine red machine, they may have some misunderstandings. Misunderstandings are misunderstood. Nothing. We are entrepreneurs. Being misunderstood is part of our daily work.

"Edge sharpness" is like this, because we were talking about "sharpness and heterogeneity when we were sleek", so we did it.

"Cut hands," This is a spoiled one. At best, it is a pickpocket. The hand cut is not enough. Although some people engage in us and get a hand full of Bondi's, try to say that it is a very cut-off. I Think that this should not be anything malicious, good faith ridicule we can also accept, no problem.

"There is no original headset in the box." Because the machine is cheap, if we sell a 5288 yuan mobile phone, I will send you two headphones.

It is not easy for our domestic entrepreneurs to do business. You have to sell more than 5,000. They say you are not morally good. You have to sell more than 1,000. He said that you do not send headphones. But this is understandable. We must go through this stage. Sometimes we have to pay for one or even two generations of time. However, we firmly believe that these domestic brands continue to become international brands, so we are full of confidence.

Although, for example, it may not be expensive for foreign manufacturers to sell 5288, domestic manufacturers may dare to sell 5288, which may offend people across the country. However, we can calmly accept this because we are entrepreneurs.

Then, "The function is hidden too deeply." This is the case. Some of our advanced features are intentionally hidden because we don’t want this phone to be too complicated. If we put these functions on the desktop, when we sell to mass consumers, such as my mother and my sister, The consumer, she sees too many complicated functions, she will fear this machine, so it is deliberately hidden. For those advanced, geek, and geek park users, for these people...

Zhang Peng: How can we dig it out?

Luo Yonghao: Right, how can he dig it out? Not to mention that we also provide some videos on how to use these hidden features. We did some videos this year on the official website. I believe these will also help everyone. We do not want so-called white users to think that it is a very complicated and professional device when they open this machine.

"If you activate, you can't return it." This is normal. If you activate it, you can't return it. Yes.

The "jitter" on the eve of the conference

Zhang Peng: The next link is more interesting. You can live on your cell phone this time. Many people say that because of the conference, it will be good.

Luo Yonghao: Everyone says that every time.

Zhang Peng: You have also talked several times before and feel that you are almost ready before the development of the fair. What kind of thinking activity was in your mind the night before this conference? give

Luo Yonghao: It seems that there is not much thinking activity, and that is to constantly modify the PPT, over and over again.

Zhang Peng: Nothing to worry about?

Luo Yonghao: Every morning before the development of the rally, it was an all-night nervous anxiety. However, the tension and anxiety at the same time when the PPT was revised was the same every year. This year, because there is no engagement in Shanghai, there is a slight difference. The last two conferences were held in the center of Mercedes in Shanghai, and the Mercedes center gave a lot of pressure. I was able to see the roof of the center of Mercedes in the window of the hotel where I live.

So, generally after dawn in the morning, I opened the curtains and saw the dome. I thought I had eaten the wrong medicine. Has more than 10,000 people flickered here? What I want to do now most is to tell them that I was under too much pressure and the conference was cancelled. But this year we felt better because we were in Shenzhen and we couldn't see the stadium in the room.

Zhang Peng: The previous pressure is quite big.

Luo Yonghao: At the same time, she is also excited. When we think of our release, they will be happy to be like that. This is nothing suspenseful. I was very excited when I thought of this, and I was also happy for them.

Zhang Peng: Actually, there was a very deep impression at the press conference that your emotions were still slightly...

Luo Yonghao: A bit out of control.

Zhang Peng: No, no, no, it is a shake.

Luo Yonghao: In fact, there are two uncontrollable jitters, so it is still out of control.

One of the jitters is this, because the jitters are so severe that the wording is not very precise. I said a word and later it was spread so much. The original words should have been: If one day we hammer phones sell so much, that we can not help but use our mobile phones, I hope everyone knows that this is for you to do. This is what I said to the audience.

But because of the excitement, I said: One day when the silly guys are also using them... So, this gives us a good weapon for people who have been black for many years. It means that other than the press conference, everyone else is here. Is a fool, who buys who stupid. This is obviously because the jitters I got out of control caused the wording to be rigorous and inaccurate. I came back to reflect on the management.

The other is the part that thrills. You know, we did a reversal of the plot design at this year's conference. The original plan was for us to show a thing that looks exactly the same as the iPhone 6 (that is, a thing that looks exactly like 99% of China's mobile phones). After this show, I firmly believe that the groups that support us will be disappointed. Because they want us to do different things, they will certainly be disappointed. This is what we expected.

But at the scene, there were two accidents:

1, we first showed a look exactly the same thing as the iPhone 6, the following really silent, very cold, we are very disappointed, this is no doubt.

2. In the following, part of the Xiaoxiuxiu software and I were due to inadequate rehearsal drills, which led to some delays. This was a very dangerous and indirect design, because it was a live broadcast because There is no room for recovery. In the middle of the drag, the audience may not be lost, but the live stream may be lost on the Internet.

So when we talked about the middle stage, both of us realized that after the drag, they were very, very nervous. Although you seem to be able to look at us easily and comfortably in the audience, each year is in a state of high tension and on the verge of collapse.

When the reversal is over, when I show the real design, I think the following should be a very pleasant surprise. It will cheer, yell, and be happy. However, their reaction still far exceeds my expectations.

The result of this was that because they reacted far more intensely than I had imagined, I was so excited that I had a strong feeling. I knew that you would do that, and that you did not hurt you. But it was too strong, so there was a little out of control and it shook again.

"Wulin master" is how to convince people?

Zhang Peng: I feel that you have changed quite a lot over the years, at least on the external presentation. For example, in the early years, you felt that your ability and ability to interact with each other was quite strong. Those who come over will surely go back and not only go back but also kneel down.

Luo Yonghao: If he wants to stab a knife, I'm sure to pick ten.

Zhang Peng: Yes, but this year, I remember that after this product came out, there were many people who were black. How did your mentality change?

Luo Yonghao: Looks.

Zhang Peng: Let's see how his appearance changes. Someone else said that your cell phone cuts his hands and can cut fruit peels. Later, he really made a video of using a mobile phone to cut fruit and gave it back. How martial arts masters deal with the challenges and disputes of others? Why did you choose this method at the time?

Luo Yonghao: Actually, in the early years, even if it was the wrong way, for example, when I came face-to-face with someone to Youku, I didn't want to be so razed. The picture I came up with was: I and the other person arrived at the scene, and then I smiled and pointed out that his hands and feet, 1234.56, all pierced him, the audience was very good, with a smile, wait until he After no more self-confidence, I then patted his shoulder with a smile and said: Young people make mistakes, God will forgive. Nothing! You are still young and there are opportunities to change. As long as you are on the right track, everyone is welcome.

But at that time, because of the two and a half months of production at Foxconn's factory, the problems that occurred every day were more than the previous day. I was on a verge of collapse. When I arrived at the studio, I fell out of control as soon as I saw each other.

Zhang Peng: It is out of control again.

Luo Yonghao: So the script that I was gesticulating in my head was not strictly executed according to the script, but it was a fierce, ferocious, and fierce confrontation in the entire process.

In the face of the public, we do not speak reasonable? This is certainly the basis, but at the same time, it is not gracefulness, gentleness, or mildness. These are equally very important, not just because you are right.

So, this thing was handled badly and I didn't even realize it at the scene. However, after watching the video of Youku back at the end of the day, I only watched for 3 minutes and I thought bad. The end result is that the support rate for the two of us is 1:1 for quality and 2:1 for quality. It looks like an improvement, but in my obscene result, it is 9:1, so 2:1 is a very Failed things.

Since then, the company has a professional public relations team and has trained me in some professional skills. We even invited a lecturer from Hong Kong who specialized in public relations training for entrepreneurs to come over to our entire management class, so it has improved. But what's in the bones is not changed.

The same is true this time, because the old thing they were peeling was spoofing, some were good-willed and some were malicious. The problem that this brings is that if we look for a seemingly malicious encounter and confront him face-to-face, Asked him to press the video "repeat me again!" Then fiercely pointed out that he is doing tricks, and then say something hard to hear, it will bring us a round of public relations crisis and disaster.

Therefore, what we are more controllable about this time is that we have received some training in professional skills, plus we have grown older...

Zhang Peng: Become kindly.

Luo Yonghao: Yes, the endocrine part of the attack on personality may also be reduced. Therefore, this is an integrated result. This is also the only way to test the growth of an entrepreneur.

Zhang Peng: At least in the way of responding, he has done a better job.

Luo Yonghao "The Man Behind"

Zhang Peng: Did everyone pay attention? While he was cutting fruit in the video, there was a man next to him. He was always smiling and kindly, and looked at him with affectionate eyes. That person was actually a theme person to talk about next, Wu Dezhou.

Recently, we all felt that you mentioned him frequently. The praises and gratitude to him were all oversight. Why do you think that old Wu is so important, and how important is the development of the hammer in this year?

Luo Yonghao: We debuted in 2012. Everyone has always acknowledged that our company is rather special and weird. We say that although we are a start-up company and a crosstalk actor, we have a long board that is longer than 500. Shorter than 500, this is a very popular view.

Therefore, the part of the long board is responsible for me. The part of the short board that I have always been very anxious has been uncertain for several years.

Since the arrival of Germany in the week, because he is a R&D and engineering professional, he has experienced the worst, worst, primitive, and roughest mobile phones in large companies. He has been doing the best in more than a decade of research and development. The coolest and most advanced, so that they have strong competitive products abroad, he has experienced all the development process.

Therefore, if we can absorb such talents to become partners in the development of our hammer technology, we hope to make our company's long board and short board have the opportunity to compete with the 500.

So for me, being able to come in such a person is a dream thing, but it was only after three and a half years of entrepreneurship that we finally realized this. Therefore, after he came in, some of my uncontrollable emotional expressions are understandable.

Zhang Peng: Basically what you summed up is that it will be enough for the long board to become a 500-level player, and it will be up to him if the short board becomes a 500-strong standard.

Luo Yonghao: The long board does not become a 500 strong standard, and long board has always surpassed the top 500 level. The short board is really short. We are even shorter than the Shenzhen Shanzhai phone factory for quite some time. This is understandable because I do not have a background in the technical circle. It will certainly be difficult at the start.

Zhang Peng: So, indeed, the addition of Lao Wu is crucial. This is also a key reason that will allow you to turn around, this time it seems that Nut Pro is very good overall in terms of hardware.

Luo Yonghao: Yes. After the Nut Pro came out, our out-of-the-box return rate, low repair rate and high user satisfaction were all unprecedented.

Also, this batch of products is the fastest in our history. Hundreds of thousands of units will be issued at the same time in a very short time. If it has many problems, it will be terrible. However, our data on after-sales maintenance is very healthy, several times lower than the historical average.

Let's look at a hard indicator of mobile phone hardware research and development, such as power consumption, heating, and battery life. When these comprehensive indicators are viewed, more than half of them have achieved the industry's upper level, compared to the difficulties we have struggled over the past few years. This is a qualitative change.

Tough 2016

Zhang Peng: In the past year, there were still some things that were not smooth. A lot of people said that they wanted to buy you.

Luo Yonghao: 2016 may be the most dangerous.

Zhang Peng: Yes, financing is not smooth, and the acquisition seems to be the last moment. You yourself seem to have said at the time that your mind is ready to be acquired as a product manager. At that moment, did you think it was very difficult to get through in 2016?

Luo Yonghao: Yes, you see this is quite interesting, saying that the acquisition of a hammer, old Luo Weibo calm response, denounce it as a rumor.

In fact, this is the case. First of all, “So-and-so would buy a hammer” is true. When I “really dismissed it as a rumor”, it was because the acquisition didn’t negotiate, so I said it was a rumor. Then said that we are going to close down. This is also very close to the truth, and almost closed down. In our entrepreneurial process, we finally had the same experience as our senior entrepreneurs. "Fortunately," we experienced two unpaid wages:

The first time was three days, we told them that there was a problem with the banking system, so there was a late payment, so it may only be sent next week. The day seems to be Friday or Thursday. It is only for the next week. Everyone pays a salary.

Then everyone in the company group talked about it and said: Either to be honest, or to compile a bit like one, how can we make such a bad one?

Zhang Peng: Hammer employees have high IQs.

Luo Yonghao: But this is not the case. The truth is this:

1, in such a time is not necessarily particularly suitable for telling the truth, because there are many colleagues are very simple, he worked hard, you told him so, he said OK, then next week, then write code Now.

Maintaining this status is actually very important, because we are left behind. For example, if we do close down next month, we have some stocks of inventories. There are procedures and laws governing the closure of companies. The first batch will be returned. It's the employee's salary, which is set aside in our budget. Therefore, there will certainly be no banner saying that the salary has not been issued, the boss carrying a small blind to abscond, and the employee pulling the banner of “Return My Hard-earned Money”. These things will not happen.

By the way, for everyone to popularize, why do some companies have their own limited liability company closed down, and people are missing? It was because he had borrowed a usury loan from the triad when he finally rescued the company. This is terrible. After you have borrowed a loan shark from the underworld, you will have to discuss with you whether to unload your left or right arm and unload your left thigh or right thigh. Therefore, the bosses of some failed companies were forced to escape. He did not want to lay off the wages.

Although we did not pay wages for the same month, we had some stocks. In the most extreme case, we could sell malignant meat and sell it and send the wages to complete the closure process. Therefore, I have the same feeling. However, if you say to all employees that you can't pay your salary, then people in the company are worried and you can't work normally.

2. The reason we compiled was actually very good, but because they did not understand the rules of bank operation, it was common for banks to arrive several days late. Originally I thought that it was very well compiled. As a result, they did not know how the bank operated. They thought that the bank had never had any problems. So he said that my excuse was badly compiled. This I am also ashamed.

The second time was really unlucky. I felt enough once in our entire business process because this experience didn't need to be repeated many times. At 12 o'clock noon, the children of human resources issued a micro letter to me saying that today it may not be able to make any salaries. It is recommended that we say earlier that we should not say when we are off work, and that when we left work, we would say that everyone’s grievances are even heavier.

It was true that there was a sum of money and that the bank did not arrive. This was 100% true. But I hesitated. I said well. I was right. When I left work, I said that everyone would be angry, so I said it earlier.

What turned out to be very angry was that human resources had just sent a notice to all 600,700 colleagues and told everyone that today's wages could not be sent because the failure of the banking system did not arrive in time. As a result, the bank’s money has arrived at the end of the first hour since it was sent. Tell us that it is now possible to send a salary. Do you know my feelings at that time? We have to inform everyone again that you see, it is really a problem with the bank and it has now arrived.

Therefore, what I want to tell you is that the entire process of starting a business is such a bloody tear. When you say something afterwards as a joke, when it was blood and tears, when you were in blood and tears, you must have the spirit of revolutionary optimism.

Several of our managements met in the hut, just like we were joking with you today. We were also joking at that time. Although my heart was terribly scary, my heart would be much better after this joke.

So you will be in the future, if you start your own business to that kind of particularly scary, be sure to bite the bullet and joke. The American imperialists shot Hollywood blockbusters and they made some jokes on the battlefield when everyone lived or died. Some people have said that this is the heroism of the United States. It has been made in such a way as to make these people seem to be particularly fearless about life and death. In fact, we are in such an environment and play a joke to ease the anxiety of ourselves and others. This has a positive effect.

If a founder does not want the company to fail, he always has a way

Zhang Peng: Lao Luo is indeed not easy. I once chatted privately with him. He said one sentence at the time: If a founder doesn't want the company to fail, he always has a way.

It was quite calm when I said it, but for me, as an entrepreneur, the impact on my heart is very great. Because I know what you were at the time. What is even more crucial is that after Lao Luo did a lot of things to save the company, we can take a look at it. At that time, you put all kinds of live platforms, content-paying platforms, and so on.

At that time, I felt that as an entrepreneur, you are no longer in the world? Most people may not experience it, but the effort behind it is very great. what are you thinking? Don't you think this is too much?

Luo Yonghao: Actually, it's okay. I've been thinking that kind of impulsively. Anyway, it's the last minute and the last second. However, there are many professionals who give me instructions when it comes to actual operations. Therefore, we strictly followed the national bankruptcy liquidation procedure and let legal affairs and finance come to our management to do a round of training. That is, if it is decided to close down one day, how should it be done in an orderly manner when it closes down, and then it will not be given to the country and the government. , people and colleagues increase the burden. We have done a whole set of process training.

When I went down, I personally talked to the media before. At most, I borrowed more than 96 million to rescue the company, including individuals going out to sell themselves and selling tens of millions into the company. Done.

There are emotional factors here, but this is basically done based on rational judgment. Because, for my personal plan of 10 or 20 years in the future of the technology industry, if the mobile phone breaks here, I must pick it up again before the advent of next-generation computing platforms.

We now have a very good team. If this team is disbanded, I'm forced to do a smart hardware after closing down. I believe that I can make a lot of money soon and then kill it back to the mobile phone. We have all done this planning. (Frankly speaking, ). However, considering the input-output ratio of the time cycle, mental state, and physical fitness, it is not as rational as saving the company now.

Therefore, we repeatedly weighed, and the pressure on each day was terribly severe. When we were nervous, we were all tingling at the fingertips. Many people think that my five years of hard work is this company, so we must desperately rescue it. This emotional part is more or less there, but the overall judgment is still a more rational result.

And we also said at the time that if I had to pay wages for one month or two months, I would be able to send this salary after stock clearance in my hands. This would not result in a mass incident or me. A person whose income is much higher than that of an employee, who owes money to a relatively poor person as a relatively rich person, cannot be justified in any way.

So this part of the budget is enough, just say whether or not to go to that step. But if you really go to that step, it must be bankruptcy liquidation.

For example, I’m not talking about other companies right or wrong. I certainly would not use my ability to shake people’s minds and ask my 600, 700 colleagues to request them for no more than three months or six months without pay. Come along with me, I will not do this kind of thing. Because once you do it, if you can't pay this money in time, there will be no way to explain this for a while. And when they are not short of money, you will re-produce them with the interest, but in fact there is no point in their lives.

Zhang Peng: It caused a loss.

Luo Yonghao: Yes, the damage caused has been irrecoverable. Based on such considerations, we are in the inventory at hand and after the liquidation of those things is enough to give them, if we can send two months, we may not be able to send wages for two months, asking them to regain a If you can send three months to three months. But no more, no, we will surely start bankruptcy and liquidation. The first step is to send the wages. The second step is to repay the bank. We have a whole set of processes. We have exercised the whole process, not an irrational one. .

Zhang Peng: So now I think of it and walk through it. Everyone we talk about today is very happy and laughter. It's all sorts of laughter. But actually, I think that in the process, people in the depths felt positive. Different.

If the hammer is really acquired...

Zhang Peng: In turn, if you were really acquired by that year, you entered a system that was powerful because of itself. Maybe Nut Pro's system can help you immediately and then users of that system. Also started to agree with Smartisan OS, start brushing, this time you may return to your words: to be a product manager happiest.

Luo Yonghao: In fact, there is nothing wrong with it, that is, to benefit the society faster and more efficiently.

Zhang Peng: When you were exposed to the acquisition, you were ready to go. What do you think of the ultimate Nut Pro today? What do you think feels more comfortable today with this state and that state?

Luo Yonghao: I am not really sure, because for me, being a good product is always the core driving force of entrepreneurship. So, is a company doing this product, must I be the boss? This matter is negotiable.

So when I talked to giant bosses about acquisitions and mergers, they asked me what kind of relationship is behind me. I think that they are more or less worried. For example, after I joined their team, as a 6 boss, 7 boss, and then the boss overshadowed the big boss, that big boss will feel pressure. When communicating, I can feel something like this exist.

But at the time I answered it was actually very honest. I said that it is happiest for me to be a product manager and to be happier than being an entrepreneur. If our future relationship can be similar to the relationship between Ma Huateng and Zhang Xiaolong, I am also very happy and willing to accept results from my career.

Luo Yonghao: You may only know that Nut Pro is selling well and we have come alive. But in the end there has been a lot of change. I would probably disclose it, and then we may also open a formal press conference.

More than 90% of China Internet start-up companies announced fraudulent valuations and financing in each round were fraudulent. There is statistical data. Because some companies must disclose the actual financing status of each round after they finally go public, some thoughtful journalists compare their historical records and find that many special cattle companies have moisture in each round of financing.

And we now say that there is no moisture, because Nut Pro goes very well, our round of financing is about 1 billion or so, at least 9 billion. There is also some supply chain finance money, so we have no surprises. From the beginning of the fall, there is probably almost 1.9 billion in cash for operations.

This means that starting next year, we will be like a regular mobile phone manufacturer that has already entered the table, with high, medium, and low segments, and will launch 5-6 products each year, which will become a regular mobile phone manufacturer.

This I can't help but share with you this good news. As for the more specific and detailed situation, we will have a press conference one or two months later. There will also be a nationwide supplier conference to witness one together. Historic moments.

Today there was no such plan, but...

Zhang Peng: Yes, you are extra for everyone.

Luo Yonghao: When I saw Peng and you, I...

Zhang Peng: You shake again.

Luo Yonghao: Right.所以对我来讲，如果我自己能继续操控这个企业往下走，其实，它给我带来最大的愉悦还是因为产品方面我不需要听谁指手划脚，而不是其他的东西，对我来讲做产品经理是最大的愿望。

张鹏：你曾经说了很多次觉得自己要成了，但是这个过程其实还是挺曲折的。这个曲折的过程到底是因为什么？如果反过来Rebuild 的话。

罗永浩：性格比较直，所以作为企业家这个职业身份的转换，是需要一些职业技能训练的，然而我没有训练就匆匆上岗了，导致公关方面给企业惹了一些不必要的麻烦。

另外，面对公众的企业，原则上做大众消费品，尽可能敌人少一些、朋友多一些，但是我们由于没太注意这些，导致前期无端地没有利益冲突地惹了一些潜在的敌人。

当然，我们也没想到他们会那么不堪，我想充其量我得罪了他们，他们只是讨厌我，没想到他们会黑我。你知道这是我对人性有时候估计的时候，以一个比较高尚的人格去妄加揣测那些不正常的人。所以，会有这些方面技术上的偏差，这是我做得很不好的一部分。

另外有一些我做得不好的一部分是，坦率地讲也没什么太多可检讨的部分，因为我本来是说相声的，去做科技公司。

张鹏：你还能指望我怎么样？

罗永浩：不是，有一句话歌词叫：没有人能随随便便成功。所以你过程里该付的学费、该上的课、该掉的坑这些是必经之路，是绕不开的。

另外，我觉得我因为个人性格上的弱点，特别耿直的性格对于做企业家是一个严重的弱点。

然后还有攻击型人格，我喜欢跟人家对质、对抗，这些都是职业身份转换过程中没有及时调整自己，这是应该检讨不成熟的部分。

张鹏：你不用把自己都检讨一遍。

罗永浩：我有社交恐惧症，所以我应该出去谈人、挖人的时候，我下意识地会去得少，这些都是我的问题。这些很多，我就不展开讨论了。

张鹏：总之在这件事上自己觉得肯定要有一个过程，速成是不太现实的，怎么也得有一个过程。

罗永浩：还有，这个行业技术、资金门槛都比较高。

张鹏：超过你一开始的想象。

罗永浩：是的。

AI 之下的手机新交互

张鹏：但是我觉得锤子是比较成功的，在最开始当你手机都没做出来的时候，你的Smartisan OS 其实就开始吸引大家很大的注意。而且，我觉得这个操作系经历过几波的进步。

咱们第一次见面聊，谈的是九宫格，图标重新画一遍，在一些小的局部里面，比如说闹钟、倒计时计时器有很多很人性化细节的设置；2.0 的时候，其实在里面就开始有很多更进一步的东西了。比如说，远程协作、语音搜索加进去；3.0 的时候开始有一步、大爆炸这种更效率型的。

这里面其实你能感觉有变化了，好像一开始是从审美的角度，然后到后面是效率的角度，甚至大家会觉得说是不是锤子的交互思维，有没有一些进化的过程？

罗永浩：整体上，我们想做一个最易用、也最漂亮、最人性化的一个系统，这个大的原则是从来都没有变过的。只是在初期的时候，因为做的是大众消费品，不是小众的，但由于缺乏对市场上的消费者的经验，所以估算得不是特别准确。所以我们做了一些过于个性化的东西。

实际上，我们今天也把很多个性化的东西做了保留，只不过隐藏在设置里了，你要打开它还是高度个性化的，如果你不打开，默认实质上可能从别的机器转过来的时候，也没有太高的学习成本，这些都是中后期意识到要调整的。

中期没什么可说的，到了偏后期的时候，我们做了一些大爆炸、闪念胶囊、一步这样的功能，其实是渐渐意识到做一些提高效率的东西会比提高那种愉悦的感受东西更重要，因为你提高那些愉悦的感受，可能是一部分人特别敏感，另外一部分人无感。但是提高效率这件事，无论任何人都是敏感的。所以我们在这方面精力投放的比例有一些问题。

但是整个三个不同的时期，我们本质上还是想做最易用、最人性化、最漂亮的系统。实际上做到今天，我也觉得我们事实上已经做到了，如果那些用户没有偏见，花点儿心思试用一下我们的操作系统，但是他们不试用，既是我的损失、也是他的损失，这是命运的安排。

所以，我相信我只要继续埋头把产品做好，有一天他们会喜欢，也会用的。

另外，说到这儿，我得说说人工智能了。因为上次咱们俩闲聊的时候你说你注意到最近的一年，所有科技公司的创始人在公开演讲或者是接受访谈的时候，不谈人工智能的我好像是最后一个了，你是讲过这个话吧？

张鹏：你就是最后一个一直没讲，我还觉得你为什么一直不讲？

罗永浩：我跟你说过，我说我注意到某一个科技公司的老板在一场1 小时30 分钟的演讲里提了157 次人工智能，而这个公司过去跟人工智能是一点儿毛关系都没有的。

为了配合今天这个活动的主题，我也想讲一下我的一些看法，因为我们过去的半年左右，无论是在手机内嵌的系统，还是我们正在做的智能音箱，还是其他的一些智能硬件，在研发过程中，跟国内人工智能方面最强的一些巨头和一些新锐的创业公司，绝大多数都有接触。

接触下来发现一个比较可喜的现象，所有这些公司都愿意为我们的产品提供技术支持，因为我们在产品方面虽然卖的量不是足够大，但是擅长忽悠，擅长制造传播和影响力，相信和这个有一定的关系。

这个给我带来的好处是，我们后续的产品跟人工智能做深度整合的时候，我们比较乐观的一点是，虽然这些巨头们每一家都吹牛说他在人工智能方面自己每一项都是最强的，但是经我们的产品经理和测试公司严格试用发现，明显是你这部分强，人家那部分强。

可是他们由于是巨头，或者有一些小公司由于已经站队，成了某巨头的阵营，所以他们使用这些技术的时候，不可避免地，如果我是A 阵营的，我就从头到脚用的全是A 的技术，这样带来的坏处是某些技术明明是B 的好，你却用了A 的。

我们比较好的是目前没有站队，并且所有公司都愿意跟我们合作，使得我们在产品里整合人工智能相关东西的时候，会在每一个板块上用的都是目前国内最好的。如果后面有更好的资源，用国际上最好的，当然我们也会用。

张鹏：你们会非常希望跟他们合作？

罗永浩：对，所以这方面是我觉得我们后续做这个东西比较高效的地方。另外我也澄清一点，很多产品经理中普遍存在的一个误解，他们认为有一天人工智能跟人一样聪明的时候，人机交互的设计就不需要了。这是一个完全错误的想法。

因为我们知道今天的机器不够聪明，我们不得不用聪明的方式设计人机交互，使得它变得好像为我们工作的时候更聪明。

接下来的问题是，如果它像人一样聪明，你就不需要设计一个聪明的方式让它来为你服务了，因为它已经足够聪明了，这是一个非常流行的观点，无论是产品经理还是设计师，还是普通用户，都有这样的观点。

我想说的是，我认为这是完全错误的。因为最终这个人工智能像人一样聪明的时候，他表现出来的形态、气质、特征，为你服务的时候采用的方式、方法、态度等等，这都是人去设计出来的。你去设计这个的过程中，你想象一下你见过糟糕的服务员和好的服务员之间是天壤之别，但是他的智力都是人类的水平。

你明白我的意思吗？所以，当我们把人工智能有一天能够设计得跟人接近一样聪明的时候，他为你服务、为你提供的产品仍然有质的区别，好的是谁做的呢？当然就是我这样的产品经理做出来的。那些烂的是谁做的呢？常常就是那些技术很先进，但是对于人机交互，对于什么是细腻的人性化的感受方面比较钝的技术巨头型的公司做出来的。

所以，从这个意义上讲，一个良好的社会有了精细的分工之后，技术型的公司做技术型的事，产品型的公司做产品型的事。从这点上，我们对于未来，无论技术怎么变迁，对我们自身的发展都是持有一个乐观的心态的。虽然不一定是对的，但是我们是这样一个信念。

张鹏：所以你在AI 这个领域，一定是跟手机的下一步也会有关系的。

罗永浩：是的。

张鹏：这次我们看到了，包括大爆炸、闪念，其实在里面都开始有这样的迹象。你今年要发T3 吧？

罗永浩：不一定叫T3。

张鹏：这个信息很重要。你在这个上面跟AI 相关的下一步，有能透露的吗？

罗永浩：会在整个系统内有更多的深度整合，但是真正比较大的重量级的东西是会在明年春天，最晚明年夏天发布的一个东西，是我自己带了一个120 人的团队（甚至这个团队不在北京，多半会在成都），用9-10 个月的时间做一个非常非常不一样的系统出来，这个系统即便不是革命性的，也是一个准革命级的系统。

最初我们跟机器交互的方式是键盘，图形界面出现以后是用鼠标+键盘，用熟了以后我们在鼠标和键盘之间用了一些高效率的互动整合方式，使得这个效率比单用键盘和鼠标的效率高得多。再到了触控设备高度符合直觉，看到哪儿点哪儿就对了。再到下一代这个东西就是我们整合了语音识别，实际上我们在操作系统方面，语音识别方面可以说是走得比较早的，借助讯飞的技术走得比较早，也做得比较深度。

我们下一代的系统是几乎可以完全扔掉鼠标键盘，只用语音识别、手的触控屏的操作，再整合一些人工智能的东西，这三个整合起来，会实现一个有望实现比现有任何手机、平板或鼠标键盘式的这种桌面电脑、笔记本电脑在日常办公上实现超过200% 以上效率的这么一个系统。

张鹏：会聚焦到办公这个层面的效率的提升？

罗永浩：对，会在明年春天左右推出，最晚夏天，这是我接下来8-10 个月最主要的工作。

张鹏：我们先把时间记下来，看看他会不会重新定义春天或者是夏天。最后一个问题，经过这么多的艰难、曲折，甚至2016 年这么多的波峰、波谷，你觉得现在锤子是一种金融面朝大海、春暖花开的这种感觉了吗？你怎么看你接下来的发展？

罗永浩：我觉得，我们过去的五年一直都是面朝大海的，因为比较有追求、比较有雄心壮志和理想主义，所以一直都是面朝大海的。但是有的时候是惊涛骇浪，有的时候是腥风血雨，有的时候是这样看起来比较愉悦的样子。只是这个区别，但是一直都是面朝大海的，星辰还没有顾上（星辰大海嘛）。

张鹏：先把大海顾上。

罗永浩：对，从另一个角度，你刚才提到春暖花开，我觉得这个基本上是不可能的，因为科技行业一旦走进去就是一条不归路，你只有每天逼着自己发疯般地往前跑、往前赶才能存活下来，所以春暖花开我们是不想的，对于我们来说春暖花开就是退休的时候，否则永远没有春暖花开，我觉得这是科技行业创业者的宿命。

但是相对于别的行业，你们知道传统的快销品行业有百年老店，像可口可乐这样的汽水，100 年以后它是第一永远是第一。如果我们有机会穿越100 年来到地球上，我相信可口可乐还是一个巨头。但是，你们见的这些硅谷的、中国的科技巨头，我估计99% 都倒闭了，换成了一波你没听说过的科技巨头。

从创业者或者是从企业家的角度看起来，这貌似是一个伤感的东西，其实从整个人类的角度看，它是非常好的，因为传统行业里正是做不出革命、突破、创新，只要人类的基因对于糖的需求是恒定的，可口可乐已经是第一的话，它永远就是第一。但是在科技行业里，来自以色列的几个小伙子，来自南非的几个小姑娘，或者是来自中国大陆的几个相声演员，颠覆一个行业、结束一个时代，这种事情是经常会发生的。

从这个意义上，我觉得这是科技行业真正令人兴奋和感到幸福的地方，这个行业没有百年老店，说明创新者是有机会的，如果一个行业200 年、300 年被一个财阀、巨头，被一个已经毫无进取心的巨头始终把持局面的话，那个才是真正悲哀的事情。

我觉得从事科技行业的人，应该心态健康和平和地去看待“没有百年老店”这件事，只要你在那个位置上一天，就没有春暖花开。

张鹏：但是可以面朝大海。

罗永浩：对，可以面朝大海，但是不要妄想春暖花开，春开只能到退休的时候，或者是倒闭的时候。

张鹏：老罗说的话触及到一些本质，创业到最后可能也不只是在于我们追求是不是要春暖花开，其实归根到底面朝大海的这种感觉是第一的，有风雨也躲不了，但是只要面朝大海，可能你才能够最终去实现自己的这种难得的机遇，在科技领域做一些有意思的事。

今天有特别感谢老罗来到现场，跟我们非常坦诚地给我们展示他的思考、成长、变化，我们也特别开心看到老罗今天能够在后面更好、更开心地做自己的产品经理。我们祝他面朝大海、不负时光，锤子就一定能成为你在过去最了不起的成就。感谢罗老师！